Bush will spin SPYING like a FRAKING TOP
Check out this NY Times article on a poll they did.
Slippery positioning on SPYING on INNOCENT Americans. This poll will help Frank Lutz and Karl Rove pick the words they will use to spin the illegal spying.
Yes, we are all for keeping track of the terrorist communications. BUT THIS ISN'T what this is about, now is it? This is about Abuse of Power .
Remember how Cheney kept linking 9/11 to Iraq when no link existed? He claimed special knowledge. When grilled he said, "Can't tell you, National Security." Well there was no link but he kept saying it over and over and over even after the PRESIDENT said there wasn't a link. They are going to do the same thing here by linking ONLY terrorists to this illegal spying.
I will bet you a crisp $100 bill that people other than terrorists will be on the list (if it ever sees the light of day). People who have NO connection to any kind of terrorism will be on it. And those people lives might be RUINED because some whiny ass chicken shits would gladly trade our hard won civil rights for their false sense of security. Hey people, stop selling out my civil rights just because you are too naive to think this spying won't be misused.
With a confidence rating approaching 99.5 I tell you that there will be people on that list who have NO business being monitored for TERRORISM. How do I know? Because the White House is 1) Incompetent 2) The data for WHO is selected to be monitored will be so vague and broad that sweeping up non-terrorists is GOING to happen.
So then the issue will be, "Is that alright?" Ignorant people who think that they have done nothing wrong will say, "No biggy, go ahead, spy on me I have nothing to hide." Oh really? Fine. But would you like to have some protection or oversight if they make a mistake? Or is it also okay if they hold you with no access to a lawyer for years? Can they do that? Sure. Even if they make a mistake? Sure.
There is NO ONE looking out for you. Bill O'Rielly isn't. No judges are. If you get accused and you get picked up you will then be wishing you stood up for some WARRENTS so that there was some oversight when the inevitable mistakes occur. Right now you have a bunch of hopped up Homeland Security Agents who might decide they need to look busy. The FBI HAS looked into some of these cases of "hot leads!" and have found them worthless and a waste of time. These were the GLENN GARY leads, the ones that went to the FBI! But THEY weren't proven worthwhile. What does that tell you? This program is an accident waiting to happen. And getting MORE leads isn't helping. It is HURTING us. Oh and I'm sure there are some right wing nut balls who will say, "But if there is an attack THEN you will be sorry that we didn't chase down everyone who said boo on a phone. " I have news for you. There will be an ATTACK but they won't catch it becasue they were busy chasing down stupid ass leads! But of course they won't spin it like that after the attack. Just like Bush got away with bearing NO responsibility after he fraked up by not shaking trees and following up on the Aug. 6 PDB, I'm sure he will get away with little damage after the second terrorist attack in the US. (Anthrax was the second.) "There is no way we could have known that they would bomb chemical plants!" That will be the mantra after the attack.
You know how Patrick Fitzpatrick talked about how serious obstruction of justice charges are? That without having the full information you can never really know if a crime was committed? WE MUST know more about who was spied upon and WHY there were chosen to be spied upon. I understand that this is serious sensitive information and that it is about national security, but let's have some GOD DAMN verification so we know that these people who we are now calling terrorists are in fact terrorists or terrorist sympathisers. And what if we find out that they aren't, terrorists, that the spying was much more extensive or was used for other purposes like oh I don't know, spying on peace groups or political enemies? Then what? Apologies? How about impeachment?
The results of this poll just piss me off. Why? Because if we HAD the information about what was really going on with the spying we could tell people if it WAS really being used correctly. Instead Bush gets to position the spying. If they hold back information in the name of "national security" and ask us to trust them we are STUPID if we trust them. Time and time again they have proved untrustworthy. Sometime they are incompetent other times they just lie. But we can't know because they are obstructing the public's right to know. ( And no, a few lies to congress about what you are doing doesn't count. Especially if by questioning the program publicly you go to jail. )
I want an independent panel, or better yet, ome democrats we can trust like Boxer or Pelosi to review this info. If they say it is being used correctly then great, but since they won't be able to review it, Bush will reposition this as "terrorist surveillance" instead of illegal domestic warrantless spying.
This spying casts a huge blanket over too many people at once and is not going to protect the American people. The FBI have already said that it will get in the way of good terrorist coverage.
On a related note, I already see people positioning the President as being free of responsibility from the next attack on the US. "If only Bush had been allowed to spy... " When the next attack is a bombing of a chemical plant, it won't be about "OUST BUSH" because the stupid apologists will say, "Bush wasn't given ENOUGH power..." No, we will find that the terrorists used personal contacts instead of electronic communication. Or they did talk and were taped but used a code that we couldn't break because they were talking in a language we still don't have enough speakers of and they will be using words that were common. They won't say bomb, they will talk about "the package" and "The place".
I've already seen the right wing noise machine starting to position Bush as not being responsibility for the next terrorism attack on US soil. Great, we still haven't found the people who did the last two, 9/11 and Anthrax.
Wow, I meant to be all Atrios-like and just say "Oy" go read this story, but it just makes me CRAZY that this issue was allowed to be spun by Rove and Bush because they are holding back information from the Americans elected officials. If this was a criminal case we could get them for obstruction of justice. But they will hide behind national security, just like they are hiding behind "Executive Privilege" in the Katrina debacle. It's always about hiding for them because they KNOW they will be busted if people found out what was really going on. And even when they are busted they slide out of responsibility. But I guess they want to save Karl up for the scandals that they haven't told us about yet.
Slippery positioning on SPYING on INNOCENT Americans. This poll will help Frank Lutz and Karl Rove pick the words they will use to spin the illegal spying.
Yes, we are all for keeping track of the terrorist communications. BUT THIS ISN'T what this is about, now is it? This is about Abuse of Power .
Remember how Cheney kept linking 9/11 to Iraq when no link existed? He claimed special knowledge. When grilled he said, "Can't tell you, National Security." Well there was no link but he kept saying it over and over and over even after the PRESIDENT said there wasn't a link. They are going to do the same thing here by linking ONLY terrorists to this illegal spying.
I will bet you a crisp $100 bill that people other than terrorists will be on the list (if it ever sees the light of day). People who have NO connection to any kind of terrorism will be on it. And those people lives might be RUINED because some whiny ass chicken shits would gladly trade our hard won civil rights for their false sense of security. Hey people, stop selling out my civil rights just because you are too naive to think this spying won't be misused.
With a confidence rating approaching 99.5 I tell you that there will be people on that list who have NO business being monitored for TERRORISM. How do I know? Because the White House is 1) Incompetent 2) The data for WHO is selected to be monitored will be so vague and broad that sweeping up non-terrorists is GOING to happen.
So then the issue will be, "Is that alright?" Ignorant people who think that they have done nothing wrong will say, "No biggy, go ahead, spy on me I have nothing to hide." Oh really? Fine. But would you like to have some protection or oversight if they make a mistake? Or is it also okay if they hold you with no access to a lawyer for years? Can they do that? Sure. Even if they make a mistake? Sure.
There is NO ONE looking out for you. Bill O'Rielly isn't. No judges are. If you get accused and you get picked up you will then be wishing you stood up for some WARRENTS so that there was some oversight when the inevitable mistakes occur. Right now you have a bunch of hopped up Homeland Security Agents who might decide they need to look busy. The FBI HAS looked into some of these cases of "hot leads!" and have found them worthless and a waste of time. These were the GLENN GARY leads, the ones that went to the FBI! But THEY weren't proven worthwhile. What does that tell you? This program is an accident waiting to happen. And getting MORE leads isn't helping. It is HURTING us. Oh and I'm sure there are some right wing nut balls who will say, "But if there is an attack THEN you will be sorry that we didn't chase down everyone who said boo on a phone. " I have news for you. There will be an ATTACK but they won't catch it becasue they were busy chasing down stupid ass leads! But of course they won't spin it like that after the attack. Just like Bush got away with bearing NO responsibility after he fraked up by not shaking trees and following up on the Aug. 6 PDB, I'm sure he will get away with little damage after the second terrorist attack in the US. (Anthrax was the second.) "There is no way we could have known that they would bomb chemical plants!" That will be the mantra after the attack.
You know how Patrick Fitzpatrick talked about how serious obstruction of justice charges are? That without having the full information you can never really know if a crime was committed? WE MUST know more about who was spied upon and WHY there were chosen to be spied upon. I understand that this is serious sensitive information and that it is about national security, but let's have some GOD DAMN verification so we know that these people who we are now calling terrorists are in fact terrorists or terrorist sympathisers. And what if we find out that they aren't, terrorists, that the spying was much more extensive or was used for other purposes like oh I don't know, spying on peace groups or political enemies? Then what? Apologies? How about impeachment?
The results of this poll just piss me off. Why? Because if we HAD the information about what was really going on with the spying we could tell people if it WAS really being used correctly. Instead Bush gets to position the spying. If they hold back information in the name of "national security" and ask us to trust them we are STUPID if we trust them. Time and time again they have proved untrustworthy. Sometime they are incompetent other times they just lie. But we can't know because they are obstructing the public's right to know. ( And no, a few lies to congress about what you are doing doesn't count. Especially if by questioning the program publicly you go to jail. )
I want an independent panel, or better yet, ome democrats we can trust like Boxer or Pelosi to review this info. If they say it is being used correctly then great, but since they won't be able to review it, Bush will reposition this as "terrorist surveillance" instead of illegal domestic warrantless spying.
This spying casts a huge blanket over too many people at once and is not going to protect the American people. The FBI have already said that it will get in the way of good terrorist coverage.
On a related note, I already see people positioning the President as being free of responsibility from the next attack on the US. "If only Bush had been allowed to spy... " When the next attack is a bombing of a chemical plant, it won't be about "OUST BUSH" because the stupid apologists will say, "Bush wasn't given ENOUGH power..." No, we will find that the terrorists used personal contacts instead of electronic communication. Or they did talk and were taped but used a code that we couldn't break because they were talking in a language we still don't have enough speakers of and they will be using words that were common. They won't say bomb, they will talk about "the package" and "The place".
I've already seen the right wing noise machine starting to position Bush as not being responsibility for the next terrorism attack on US soil. Great, we still haven't found the people who did the last two, 9/11 and Anthrax.
Wow, I meant to be all Atrios-like and just say "Oy" go read this story, but it just makes me CRAZY that this issue was allowed to be spun by Rove and Bush because they are holding back information from the Americans elected officials. If this was a criminal case we could get them for obstruction of justice. But they will hide behind national security, just like they are hiding behind "Executive Privilege" in the Katrina debacle. It's always about hiding for them because they KNOW they will be busted if people found out what was really going on. And even when they are busted they slide out of responsibility. But I guess they want to save Karl up for the scandals that they haven't told us about yet.
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